From AniDB:
<b>"lack of karaoke bothers me, I hope they plan on including it in future episodes."..."For now this project gets an 8/10 for me for lack of karaoke unless they add it then it will be 9/10. But other than that its great!"</b>
Whoever you are, I hope you die. I don't care about the rating, what I hate about you is how you came about rating us. So you're saying if I do super uber karaoke you'd give me a perfect score? Great, I'll get right on that.
Original karaoke rant <b>here</b>.
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No. 99 Anonymous April 24, 2006 05:45 |
Re: I hate you all
Sir, affecting a superior tone in an internet argument makes you look like a fucking faggot, sir. Especially if you then go and write things like "ridiculizing". |
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No. 100 Anonymous April 24, 2006 05:48 |
Re: I hate you all
Let's see, it serves no real purpose, and it clutters up the screen and obstructs the original animation (which I, at least, want to actually see), yet somehow a fansub isn't "complete" without it? Tell me, then, what value does it add, that outweighs the annoyance of covering up and distracting from the original opening animation? |
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No. 101 Anonymous April 24, 2006 05:53 |
Re: I hate you all
Since LordBrian won't spell this out in easy words for you, maybe I should: Lunar's quality is horrible. They also have a tendency to add idiotic and distracting eye candy like partially-revealing subtitles that seriously make it harder to follow their subs. Lots of people work to a higher standard than that, and that obviously includes The Triad. |
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No. 102 Anonymous April 24, 2006 05:58 |
Re: I hate you all
A professional Japanese translator and closet otaku recently opined to a friend that the current highest-quality fansub groups are The Triad and iitran. Guess what? Neither do karaoke. |
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No. 103 Kanna April 24, 2006 09:11 |
Re: I hate you all
You rule. Have a cookie. :) |
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No. 104 Kanna April 24, 2006 09:28 |
Re: I hate you all
I'm sorry, did you say we sub FOR the people? We sub for no one but ourselves. The motivation for subbing a show is not from popularity, but self-interest. If we were subbing for the people we wouldn't be doing stuff like Nanoha and Akagi now would we? We'd allocate our resources to slave over whatever's most popular if that were the case. People expect a karaoke because it's been around for god knows how many years now. That is true, and it's hard to break normality. Karaoke is not required by any subbing standard. We don't believe that by using karaoke we will achieve a higher quality level, as it has nothing to do with understanding the dialogue and visuals at all. Furthermore, many people usually skip the OP/ED after the first time, so there's no reason to do extra work for something they aren't going to watch. Though if I was subbing for the people, it would be people I know, like my friends. I know they could care less about karaoke, so I don't bother doing it. One last thing: We CAN take criticism. If you have a problem with a line that looks mistranslated, if you hate the text style because it's hard to read, or if you found a line that wasn't properly edited, we will be more than happy to defend our decisions through explanation. Browse the Class 5-2 thread in our forums for an example. |
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No. 105 Anonymous April 24, 2006 11:13 |
Re: I hate you all
Well, I don't care about karaoke, in fact it's actually going on my nerves in some cases: I really hate it, when a fansub-group includes karaoke within the series and not only the OP/ED. Characters may sing in a series, yeah, let them, but why the hell include karaoke to the singing? To say it in one sentence: I love The Triad for not making karaoke -- and of course because of the quality subs ... |
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No. 106 LordBrian April 24, 2006 11:33 |
Re: I hate you all
Are you the same guy as above with the reading comprehension issues, or a different guy? |
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No. 107 LordBrian April 24, 2006 11:34 |
Re: I hate you all
Having poorly done, distracting karaoke can take away from the enjoyment of watching a show. I define this as reducing the quality and overall point of the fansub. |
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No. 108 LordBrian April 24, 2006 11:43 |
Re: I hate you all
<i>Because in the end you make subs FOR the people, a sub is good when someone gets what he wants from it and is pleased by it.</i> Incorrect. In the end, I make subs for <i>myself</i>. It is a hobby, not a profession. I consider the lack of karaoke good because it is what I want and it pleases me, so I guess by your logic the sub must be good. You can try to make a blanket statement about the reasons people sub all you want, but it's simply not going to be true no matter how you word it. That's why I am not criticizing fansub groups who add karaoke to their subs, because if that's what they want to get out of the hobby, then so be it. It comes down to the idiot leechers once again. I fansub for myself, and I live up to what I consider to be acceptable quality. We release these episodes to the public because some people prefer to have subs the way I do. Others do not, for valid reasons. Others do not, for invalid reasons. These people are sorely in need of "ridiculizing," as you so elegantly put it. It doesn't matter what score he gave my work, because his standards will never be what I consider acceptable. I also think giving scores to something like fansubs on a super biased scale not based on any sort of standard is pretty lame to begin with, but that's another discussion entirely. I also agree with the other guy who replied to you. |
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No. 109 Anonymous April 24, 2006 12:04 |
Re: I hate you all
and having good karaoke can add to the enjoyment. Admit it! |
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No. 110 Anonymous April 24, 2006 12:24 |
Re: I hate you all
You're intitled to your opinion and so is he, however you make it sound like its a fact(and sadly he does too). I find the partially revealing subtitles easy to follow and just add to the enjoyment of the shows, just as karaoke does and just as anything else that could potentially be added but not required. |
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No. 111 Anonymous April 24, 2006 12:27 |
Re: I hate you all
Soon 66 posts made about karaoke: PROOF THAT KARAOKE IS, INDEED, EVIL. |
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No. 112 LordBrian April 24, 2006 12:38 |
Re: I hate you all
I'm sure it can, to some people. That extra enjoyment is superfluous, though. |
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No. 113 Anonymous April 24, 2006 12:41 |
Re: I hate you all
(the person in question) Well I’m sorry but you weren't the group that created fansub scene. My standards are based on how the scene works not on how your group works. And if you think that isn't objective then that’s fine I got no problem with that. But if you blow up at all people who base their reviews on the current standards (audio, video, karaoke, translation, extras) which just about every OTHER group uses, then you show how pathetic a group you really are. Anyway I don't plan on changing my basis whatsoever unless for some weird reason every single group out there completely quits doing karaoke. |
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No. 114 Anonymous April 24, 2006 13:08 |
Re: I hate you all
It may be, but almost every group does it as a standard these days. |
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No. 116 Anonymous April 24, 2006 16:59 |
Re: I hate you all
Well, wanna know something? I'm a fansubber who is considering dropping karaoke too, and I'm not from The-Triad. Karaoke is pure eye-candy, nothing more, nothing less. |
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No. 117 Anonymous April 24, 2006 18:15 |
Re: I hate you all
Sir, might I observe that this practice is accepted as the way to write 'letters to the editor', and that while out-of-place on teh intarweb, it is not, per se, indicative of an attempt to condescend. Other than that, I can offer no observation, as his contribution was tl;dr. |
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No. 118 Anonymous April 24, 2006 22:48 |
Re: I hate you all
Wow, so a bunch of idiots voting on anidb is all of a sudden an indication of the "quality" of a fansub? |
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No. 119 Anonymous April 24, 2006 23:02 |
from the original karaoke rant:
"karaoke is gay and anyone who demands it likes taking it up the poop chute" how DARE you offend the gay population by insinuating that they like karaoke! i demand that LB retract this statement immediately! |
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No. 120 Anonymous April 24, 2006 23:06 |
Re: I hate you all
That means that almost every group is flawed in stupidity |
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No. 121 Anonymous April 24, 2006 23:12 |
Re: I hate you all
you don't know how to spell entitled, therefore your opinion doesn't matter. better luck next time |
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No. 122 Anonymous April 24, 2006 23:18 |
Re: I hate you all
i feel sorry for his SAT english score |
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No. 123 Anonymous April 24, 2006 23:22 |
Re: I hate you all
its not as evil as me >:D |
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No. 124 Anonymous April 24, 2006 23:27 |
Re: I hate you all
bwahahaa, so you claim to be the authority on fansub history now? karaoke in the "scene" is in reality a very new thing, and early fansubs certainly did not have it. but i guess you wouldn't know that. it'd be difficult to get access to fansubs in elementary school. |
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No. 127 LordBrian April 24, 2006 23:38 |
Re: I hate you all
I'm sorry, I missed the part where I said I cared how you felt about karaoke. |
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No. 128 LordBrian April 24, 2006 23:41 |
Re: from the original karaoke rant:
Everyone who demands karaoke is gay. Everyone who is gay does not necessarily demand karaoke. I'd draw you one of those diagrams with the intersecting circles, but I'm obviously far too lazy. |
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No. 129 Anonymous April 24, 2006 23:48 |
Re: I hate you all
Why make a big fuss about it then? |
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No. 130 Anonymous April 24, 2006 23:51 |
Re: I hate you all
Whether its new or not isn't the point here. And i never said i was, by your logic you seem to be the authority in judging people. You were probably in your mother when I was in elementary school. |
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No. 131 Anonymous April 25, 2006 04:30 |
Re: I hate you all
I would like to propose the notion, sir, that anybody - I might even say, everybody - who would write a 'letter to the editor', is, in fact, a fucking faggot, and thus my original statement is supported and reinforced. |
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No. 132 Anonymous April 25, 2006 05:26 |
Re: I hate you all
holy crap, talk about topic of the decade! I think of karaoke (like most other people here) as distracting eyecandy. When I watch a karaoke'd fansub, instead of watching the OP/ED animation whilst reading the English translation I end up reading the romaji bounce/fade/explode in a shower of twinkly crap to the beat of the song. Now I just watch each version of the OP/ED on the first episode it appears on and skip subsequent ones. Anybody who thinks karaoke is a requirement of a fansub to "fully enjoy the quality of blahblahblahblingblingblingblah" is just a greedy bastard. Stop asking for shit you don't really need! Sure karaoke is nice to have, but is it a requirement? Is it necessary for me to enjoy the fansub? Fuck No! I read the subs and enjoy the anime, not sing to my damn computer. |
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No. 133 Anonymous April 25, 2006 06:35 |
Re: I hate you all
lmao. What does karaoke have to do with an anime anyways? |
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No. 134 Anonymous April 25, 2006 12:06 |
Re: I hate you all
Nothing, thats why i was reviewing the group not the anime.... |
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No. 135 LordBrian April 25, 2006 12:08 |
Re: I hate you all
Might I point out that <i>you</i> are the one coming to <i>our</i> website to complain about something we said, thus you are the one exerting more effort. We're already here, so we might as well say something. |
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No. 136 Anonymous April 25, 2006 12:19 |
Re: I hate you all
I'm just defending my views from your public flogging, I told you already. You guys started this thing. I could care less if you ever add karaoke or not in the end. When I wrote that little review i had no idea that you guys had those issues with karaoke, I'm not your fanboy. This is probably the only time i've ever been to your site. If that means I'm an idiot so be it. |
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No. 138 Anonymous April 25, 2006 15:57 |
Re: I hate you all
I think the, or at least one of the points of that question was that since the actual purpose of a fansub is to help other fans to understand the anime, what does karaoke have to do with that? Here's a hypothetical question for you. Since karaoke to you is worth 1/10, suppose someone releases a fansub with just karaoke and nothing else, with crappy encoding etc. Would you still rate this "fansub" a 1/10 even though it may not even be appropriate to call it a fansub? Also one of problems is if you actually take karaoke into account when rating a fansub is that by that method, fansubs with karaoke and above average translations etc can be on the same level of quality of fansubs with no karaoke, and superior translations etc. Surely you can see the flaw in that and it affects the overall rating, which may be the only thing *some* people would look at. |
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No. 139 Anonymous April 25, 2006 16:01 |
Re: I hate you all
"I still like your translations its just karaoke would make it better." I'm puzzled as to how karaoke improves translations |
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No. 140 Anonymous April 25, 2006 18:23 |
Re: I hate you all
“I'm puzzled as to how karaoke improves translations” Enjoy ability, overall experience, some people do watch the op and ed just for that karaoke etc etc. “I think the, or at least one of the points of that question was that since the actual purpose of a fansub is to help other fans to understand the anime, what does karaoke have to do with that?” Someone watching could potentially learning how to pronounce words better. “Here's a hypothetical question for you. Since karaoke to you is worth 1/10, suppose someone releases a fansub with just karaoke and nothing else, with crappy encoding etc. Would you still rate this "fansub" a 1/10 even though it may not even be appropriate to call it a fansub?” The karaoke itself isn’t worth 1/10 and no I, wouldn’t. I’d say the group’s devotion to include it into their fansub is worth the “1/10”. “Also one of problems is if you actually take karaoke into account when rating a fansub is that by that method, fansubs with karaoke and above average translations etc can be on the same level of quality of fansubs with no karaoke, and superior translations etc. Surely you can see the flaw in that and it affects the overall rating, which may be the only thing *some* people would look at.” Only if you ignored the rest of the review. Well much like triad did :) |
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No. 141 Anonymous April 25, 2006 18:58 |
Re: I hate you all
"Enjoy ability, overall experience, some people do watch the op and ed just for that karaoke etc etc." Neither of which have anything have anything to with the quality/accuracy of translations, which is what matters(we're not talking about the fansub overall). So essentially it's just really just eye candy for you and you just give points for the effort. That just means the karaoke is really superfluous as either LB or Kanna said. "Someone watching could potentially learning how to pronounce words better." Which again has nothing to do with understanding what's going on in the anime(which again is the point of these fansubs as i've already said), which is the point raised not how you could potentially learn a bit of Japanese. "Only if you ignored the rest of the review. Well much like triad did :)" So you only reply about the overally rating but not the flaw in taking into account karaoke. |
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No. 142 Anonymous April 25, 2006 19:38 |
Re: I hate you all
"Neither of which have anything have anything to with the quality/accuracy of translations, which is what matters(we're not talking about the fansub overall). So essentially it's just really just eye candy for you and you just give points for the effort. That just means the karaoke is really superfluous as either LB or Kanna said." This is what matters TO YOU in your opinion. I rate for fansub overall. And I agree its superfluous but so many groups do it i rate for it. Like i said, if for some reason all groups quit doing it i'd quit rating for it. "Which again has nothing to do with understanding what's going on in the anime(which again is the point of these fansubs as i've already said), which is the point raised not how you could potentially learn a bit of Japanese." Which is why you don't have to watch it if you don't want to but as i said adding it in shows devotion. "So you only reply about the overally rating" Yes. "but not the flaw in taking into account karaoke." Perhaps the karaoke itself is a flaw, that being so why do just about every single group that exists (even the ones that are better than triad i could care less about the half assed ones like "your mom" and "your dad" etc) do it? Simple, its a nice extra that doesn't hinder, hurt, nor obscure the animation itself, it simply adds enjoyment to the experience of watching a fansub. Those who dislike it can simply not watch it or skip the op/ed all togeather and ignore remarks about it on a review that was intended for the general audience. Basically I wouldn't rate for it in the first place if I didn't expect it. |
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No. 143 LordBrian April 25, 2006 20:13 |
Re: I hate you all
<i>And I agree its superfluous but so many groups do it i rate for it.</i> Ah, so you finally got to the core of the matter. You don't rate a fansub on its own merit -- you rate it <i>as compared to other fansubs</i>, or how you think the fansub "standard" should be. Why the hell do you think we should conform to this arbitrary standard? Answer: we shouldn't. It's a good thing, too, since we don't. Of course, when you say things like: <i>its a nice extra that <b>doesn't hinder, hurt, nor obscure</b> the animation itself</i> it's obvious that you're just talking out of your ass anyway, since the only thing that eyecandy karaoke <i>objectively</i> does is obscure the animation, as proven by the fact that it, oh I dunno, covers up the animation and draws the eye away from (wait for it) <i>the animation</i>. I'd throw you a shovel, but that hole you're standing in is pretty deep already. |
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No. 144 Anonymous April 25, 2006 20:19 |
Re: I hate you all
"This is what matters TO YOU in your opinion. I rate for fansub overall. And I agree its superfluous but so many groups do it i rate for it. Like i said, if for some reason all groups quit doing it i'd quit rating for it." Well good for you. But somehow you have forgotten that this was about your comment about karaoke improving translations, which is why i brought up quality/accuracy because that's all you can judge translations on, please don't go off on a tangent. If you so many groups start plugging their own web site through a video segment like Wannabefansub's first episode of School Rumble, would you rate that stuff too then as some people may have found that it added to their enjoyability of the fansub. "Which is why you don't have to watch it if you don't want to but as i said adding it in shows devotion." So i show that your point about learning pronouncing Japanese words has nothing to do with understanding the anime, and you give that sort of reply by saying "you don't have to watch it"(which we all know). How convenient... "Perhaps the karaoke itself is a flaw, that being so why do just about every single group that exists (even the ones that are better than triad i could care less about the half assed ones like "your mom" and "your dad" etc) do it?" Except I never even said anything about karaoke itself being a flaw. I'm talking about the flaw in the way you rate a fansub(like what Kanna's news post says), especially when you bring in other group's fansubs into comparison. |
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No. 145 Anonymous April 25, 2006 20:21 |
Re: I hate you all
"Ah, so you finally got to the core of the matter. You don't rate a fansub on its own merit -- you rate it as compared to other fansubs, or how you think the fansub "standard" should be." No, I rate for what is as of now. "Why the hell do you think we should conform to this arbitrary standard?" I don't think you should. Need i repeat myself? "i could care less if YOU do or don't" but others do so i rate for it. "it's obvious that you're just talking out of your ass anyway, since the only thing that eyecandy karaoke objectively does is obscure the animation, as proven by the fact that it, oh I dunno, covers up the animation and draws the eye away from (wait for it) the animation." The same could be said about the subtitles themsevles as you have to remove your eyes from the animiation itself to read them, no? And of course they do cover the animation, right? Tsk tsk. |
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No. 146 Anonymous April 25, 2006 20:24 |
Re: I hate you all
You're entire comment lacks good grammar. Therefore your comment doesn't matter. Better luck next time. |
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No. 147 Anonymous April 25, 2006 20:27 |
Re: I hate you all
hey and so does mine, no more grammar nazi please, thank you. |
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No. 148 Anonymous April 25, 2006 20:43 |
Re: I hate you all
"Well good for you. But somehow you have forgotten that this was about your comment about karaoke improving translations, please don't go off on a tangent. " I didn't say it improved translations did i? If i did i appologize. I believe i have said MANY times that it improves fansub enjoyment. "which is why i brought up quality/accuracy because that's all you can judge translations on," No its not. quality/accuracy/enjoyment(notes, extras, karaoke). "So i show that your point about learning pronouncing Japanese words has nothing to do with understanding the anime" uh-huh. I agree, what else am i to say? "Except I never even said anything about karaoke itself being a flaw." I know because i said that :) "I'm talking about the flaw in the way you rate a fansub(like what Kanna's news post says), especially when you bring in other group's fansubs into comparison." What do i compare it to then? other than other groups. I mean when a group does an exceptional job, what else is there to point out but the minor flaws left over? If you are claiming i would review a very poor group and say "oh but they have karaoke! That makes it all better!" no i wouldn't do that. I'd ignore that part completely. |
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No. 151 Anonymous April 25, 2006 20:51 |
Re: I hate you all
you take my comments too literal. I meant "I still like your translations, its just karaoke would make the fansub bettter" |
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No. 152 Anonymous April 25, 2006 21:00 |
Conversation cutt off?
A bug? I used the pid number to find them. But thats weird =x |
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No. 153 Kanna April 25, 2006 21:28 |
Re: Conversation cutt off?
Ya broke it. |
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No. 154 Anonymous April 26, 2006 01:25 |
Re: I hate you all
100GET |